Reinforcements Attack and Laminate cards

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 12:03 am

Did anyone else buy this product? I don't play the game very often but I got a chance to try it out today when I used the Jagdpanther for the Lyrans.

One problem though: when using the same washable markers I've always used to record damage and other information the markers didn't erase from the sheet. Or more accurately they half-erase and leave a faded but still very visible mark on the sheet. I pulled out the Kzinti drone destroyer (from RA) and tried my markers on that and it was the same result. Evidently the manner in which the cards were laminated is different from the manner that other cards were laminated for previous products. They have a discernably different look and texture. As a result of playing today my card is pretty much ruined. I can use it again of course but every time I do it'll get more and more marked up until it's eventually unplayable.

Has anyone else had this experience? If the cards in Reinforcements Attack are typical of the lamination in subsequent products I don't see much reason to buy them. The cards will be usable once and ruined thereafter. Also makes me question whether this is the first product to have cards like these or not. Not sure whether it's worth buying the later products leading up to Reinforcements attack

djdood · Post by **djdood** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 3:11 am

Don't know about any changes in laminating, but I've had good luck getting "Whoops! Wrong marker. That was a Sharpie!" marks off of my cards with some rubbing alcohol and a little elbow grease.

Sgt_G · Post by **Sgt_G** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 5:52 am

Dry-erase markers aren't actually dry. If the marks are a day to a couple weeks old and dried out, try scribbling on them with a fresh dry-erase marker, and then wiping them off with a clean paper napkin. That will -sometimes- take them off.

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Sun Dec 28, 2014 5:39 pm

Well, point is I was playing three Lyran ships during the battle. Two Heavy Cruisers from earlier products and the Jagpanther. With the other two ships I had no problem removing the marker, but with the jagpanther it left a faded mark wherever I did it. So it's not the markers, it's the ship sheet. SSD or whatever it's called in this system. When testing the other ship I marked the bottom of the ship and then wiped the mark off about 20 seconds later and it still left the faded mark.

The markers are water soluable, suitable for using on overhead projectors (if anyone remembers what those are). I'll see if I can figure out a way to clean it. Might try the alcohol.

Post by **Steve Cole** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 12:53 am

Very strange and never reported before. You might have gotten a card with a defective coating? Only guess I have. Next time you order something ask for a replacement card.

koogie · Post by **koogie** » Mon Dec 29, 2014 3:00 am

Try Mr Clean Magic Eraser

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:05 am

Steve Cole wrote:Very strange and never reported before. You might have gotten a card with a defective coating? Only guess I have. Next time you order something ask for a replacement card.

Thanks I'll have a go at some of the suggestions and then if that fails will look at my cards. I'm currently away from home and don't have all of the RA cards with me so I don't yet know which cards are affected.

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:35 am

Yeah so I had another look at the cards and I don't think there's any real reason to ask for replacement cards, because when I tried marking all the different cards, the result was identical.

Since starting Federation Commander I've used Staedtler Lumocolor non-permanent overhead markers on my Federation commander ship cards. They've always erased with no problem, even when not erasing them for months afterwards.

But with the cards from Reinforcements Attack and Boosters 34 and 36 the markers do not erase.

Thinking it might be my markers I tried the Markerboard people Dry Erase Marker which was included with Klingon Border. On a couple cards when I marked random spots it erased no problem, but when I marked the squadron side of the battlestation card it likewise did not erase. When I tried harder to erase it using only paper towel and water the card itself became damaged.

I dunno. The cards from these three products (and presumably Booster 35 which I did not purchase) are different from the rest of my ship cards. They are visibly less glossy and reflective to the point where I can easily distinguish them in a stack of cards from other products; the sound they make when being shuffled is distinctly different as well.

No one on this board has made mention of it, I don't know if people have specifically played with ships from these products using dry erase markers directly on the cards or not. I know that one individual who commented on BGG made light of the difference and advised people against marking them directly:

http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1125871 ... rd-coating

To me I can't really use the ship cards as is. I can try the marker supplied with Klingon Border marker as it seems to erase in most cases but in other cases is likewise permanent. It's possible that myself and this gentleman got a bad batch but presumably they all came from the same printing and would be to the same standard.

So, I dunno.

gar1138 · Post by **gar1138** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 4:51 pm

You might try using sheet protectors with the cards. I use sheet protectors every time when playing, just to keep everything in "like new" condition.

8.5" x 5.5" sheet protectors work great, something like these:
http://www.staples.com/Staples-5-1-2-x- ... uct_616224

Garrett

Post by **Steve Cole** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 6:41 pm

This is very strange. I went and got a selection of cards (including those) and markers and all of them work just fine. Nobody else has complained. I'm at a loss to understand what's going on. We did switch card providers 5 years ago, and the cards from the two places are different, but all of them work the same for me.

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Wed Jan 07, 2015 10:10 pm

Well I don't know. That's the case with cards I have anyway. I know one other individual in the other thread said he returned Reinforcements attacks as well specifically because the cards were damage though he didn't specify what exactly the problem was.

http://www.starfleetgames.com/federatio ... php?t=5218
(7th post by Rog)

Next time I order I suppose I'll ask for replacements on the Battle Station and the Jagdpanther since those are the two I've marked up.

gar1138 wrote:You might try using sheet protectors with the cards. I use sheet protectors every time when playing, just to keep everything in "like new" condition.

8.5" x 5.5" sheet protectors work great, something like these:
http://www.staples.com/Staples-5-1-2-x- ... uct_616224

Garrett

Yeah I could do that but it kind of defeats the purpose of buying laminated/gloss cards if I need to further protect them.

Paul B · Post by **Paul B** » Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:59 am

I put an order for a few products in today and mentioned the two damaged cards.

Thanks.

Cat Who Sleeps With Dogs · Tue Jul 14, 2015 4:34 am

I am having the same issue. In the last six months I have bought everything in print for Federation Commander (yes, everything) and about 30% of my ship cards have a sort of matte finish from which wet erase markers will not erase from at all.

I was also using Staedtler Lumocolor wet-erase markers. They work great on the glossy cards (and every other piece of laminated material I have used them on) but not on these matte cards.

Fortunately, we are just getting into some of the booster ships so I only have a few I am going to need to order replacements for.

Post by **Steve Cole** » Tue Jul 14, 2015 5:35 pm

Email Leanna about those things (sales@StarFleetGames.com) as she had the printing company do a batch of them over again due to the coating being single layer instead of triple layer.