Option mount questions

[Nerroth]

Hi.


*In the point value adjustment list in (5L1), the playtest PPD is listed, but the also-playtest ion cannon and IPG are not. Would their values be the same as they are in SFB, i.e. +0 each?


*In SFB, it's noted that the Pharaoh and Hamilcar Cartels are allowed to consider both ion cannons and IPGs as 'operating territory' weapons - though it is noted how relatively rare use of the latter is, even compared to the already-rare use of the former.

(One could imagine a pirate ship using one or both systems as perhaps having a crew of rogue Vudar, who may like to be reminded of home...)

However, while (4R1e) says that ion cannons are available for Orion ships, (5R1e) does not allow IPGs the same option.

Should both weapons not be allowed for (limited) Orion use, in keeping with the SFB allowances?


*This next question is going from (patchy) memory, as I'm still waiting to get my own copy of CL40:

I gather that in FC, the M81 Pirates have a little more flexibility in terms of what direct-fire weapons they can use in their option mounts. (I suppose this could approximate as-yet-unknown weapons in M81, or perhaps allow for greater tactical flexibility if using these ships in the simulators.)

However, for weapons which require a double-space mount (such as the PPD) do the option mounts on the main hull of M81 Pirate ships count as such, if necessary?


*Further, even if the OGD is allowed to use a double-space system (such as an ESG), would it be restricted from using PPDs, given that no Size Class 4 ship may mount that weapon in SFB?

In other words, would the PPD only be an option for the OGR (if at all)?


*And also, do the point values shown in (5L1) apply for any relevant weapons systems placed into M81 Pirate option mounts (if only as a simulator exercise)?

[mjwest]

*In the point value adjustment list in (5L1), the playtest PPD is listed, but the also-playtest ion cannon and IPG are not. Would their values be the same as they are in SFB, i.e. +0 each?

The Ion Cannon is +0. The IPG cannot be used outside the "simulators". Since we do not give "simulator" costs in FC, the cost of the IPG is not given.

*Should both weapons not be allowed for (limited) Orion use, in keeping with the SFB allowances?

The IPG is not allowed to be used in option mounts outside the simulator. That is why the FC rules as they are. If you did use them (in the simulator), then they could be used where an ESG is used. (Yes, they take up "two boxes".) However, as mentioned above, simulator use is not listed in FC, so the IPG cannot be taken.

The Ion cannon, however, is available to Orions if they wish.

Also note that there are no "Cartel home territory" rules. A weapon is either available for use, or it is not. The only selection restrictions are given in the Rev 5 (5L1) rule, or in Orion Attack (5L1) rule.

*I gather that in FC, the M81 Pirates have a little more flexibility in terms of what direct-fire weapons they can use in their option mounts.

(I deleted the rest of the question for brevity.)

The answer is given in CL40. The four central mounts are "adjacent centerline" mounts. The OGR could carry Pl-S, PPD, or ESG if it so desired, assuming the use of simulators or the conjectural presence in the Milky Way.

*In other words, would the PPD only be an option for the OGR (if at all)?

The ODR could not use Pl-S or PPD, even in the simulator.

*And also, do the point values shown in (5L1) apply for any relevant weapons systems placed into M81 Pirate option mounts (if only as a simulator exercise)?

Yes, they still apply.

[Nerroth]

In my copy of Module F2, it does not say the IPG was available only as a simulator weapon for the Orions:

(G36.16) OPTION MOUNTS: IPGs cost zero BPV to install in an option mount(s) of a ship under Annex #8B or #8H. The Orion Pharaoh and Hamilcar Cartels treat this as an operating territory weapon but rarely use it due to the ion energy requirement.

Has this rule been revised to make this option unavailable outside of the SFB simulators?


Also, to clarify, when you say Plasma-S, is it assumed that the M81 ships can only fire it in bolt mode, or can it launch a seeker as well? (My understanding was that the M81 pirates were not intended to use seeking weapons.)


Indeed, if it can fire bolt only, is the point value adjustment the same, or is it (and that for any other plasma weapon) reduced accordingly?


Oh, speaking of direct-fire options - can an M81 pirate ship given the appropriate plasma launcher use the carronade function?

[mjwest]

In my copy of Module F2, it does not say the IPG was available only as a simulator weapon for the Orions:

(G36.16) OPTION MOUNTS: IPGs cost zero BPV to install in an option mount(s) of a ship under Annex #8B or #8H. The Orion Pharaoh and Hamilcar Cartels treat this as an operating territory weapon but rarely use it due to the ion energy requirement.

Has this rule been revised to make this option unavailable outside of the SFB simulators?

Don't know. I was going by the Annex #8B in G3, and it explicitly shows that the IPG is simulator only territory.

Also, to clarify, when you say Plasma-S, is it assumed that the M81 ships can only fire it in bolt mode, or can it launch a seeker as well?

Any use of a Pl-S in an old galaxy raider in any galaxy is a pure simulator exercise. Since it is simulator, you can pretty much do what you want.

Same for carronade.

[mjwest]

Thank you for asking the question in the SFB forums about using IPGs in options mounts.

In light of the answer (that the annex is wrong, but the rule was right), I still think the IPG should NOT be allowed in Orion option mounts in FC. The reason is because it is too powerful in FC. In SFB, the use in Orions was limited due to the incredibly small amount of impulse power on the ships. Without that "power differentiation" in FC, the IPG would become vastly more useful in FC. Therefore, I still think that the IPG should not be allowed in Orion option mounts in FC.

(In other words, I am using different means to obtain the same results.)

[Nerroth]

One other option mount question.

So far as I can tell, Orion (or WYN) ships in the Middle Years are not restricted from using Phaser-Gs - though the technology was not so widely spread at that time.

Should the Hydrans be the only ones allowed to use gatlings on their ships in the Middle Years, are are they fair game for Orion or WYN players?

[mjwest]

There is no rule that covers that. I would recommend against letting Orions use them.

[Hod K'el]

I thought Wyn did not get PH-G's at all.

[swarakulkarni]

In light of the appropriate response (that the addition isn't right, however the standard was correct), regardless I figure the IPG ought NOT be permitted in Orion choice mounts in FC. The reason is on the grounds that it is excessively amazing in FC. In SFB, the utilization in Orions was restricted because of the unfathomably little measure of drive control on the boats. Without that "control separation" in FC, the IPG would turn out to be tremendously increasingly helpful in FC. In this manner, regardless I feel that the IPG ought not be permitted in Orion choice mounts in FC.

[Steve Cole]

Mike West will fix it in the next Communique.

[mjwest]

Note that rule (5L1) has been update in the nine years since this thread was last used. That rule now answers the questions on IPGs and Ph-3s.
- Orions may not use IPGs as stated in (5L1a).
- Orions may use a single Ph-G (5L1a).
- WYNs may use an extremely small number of Ph-Gs (5L8).

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