Gary,

you're no third wheel. I was actually responding to your Nepolian post. I think Nepolian would be a bit too early in Earth history though.

I wouldn't mind if our past history wasn't changed at all and we make the great change in our future, perhaps after a nuclear war which the Romulans detect.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:05 pm: Edit

Loren,


The Napoleon post was from Joe.


My idea is for a Vulcan contact at, say, 1910 - which has the various Great Powers of the era take part in a Terran League (through which troops and colonists would pass into the galaxy, and which may or may not use Esperanto for official purposes) and that this league eventually becomes the de facto planetary government.

So, you'd still get Germans, Russians, Americans and others involved - but also a gradual sense of identity as Terrans, relative to all those alien species.


One could imagine the evocations of H.G. Wells by the authors and historians of the time...

By Michael C. Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:17 pm: Edit

I have to vote against Nazis also.

HOW about the Italian and Spanish fascists crush Hitler (because he was a nut)?

IIRC, these fascists were't terribly rascist, but then again they weren't terrible effective militarily either.

And I have to think that having the French in charge would be a hoot.

So instead of miniskits and gogo boots you'd have berets and 6 weeks of vacation. Gosh help the empire if it was attacked during August.

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:17 pm: Edit

How about, Hitler dies in the summer of 1940 after France falls but before the decision to attack the USSR is irrevocable. . .the Romulans assasinate him but it looks like natural causes.

Goring (who is at the height of his popularity and political power at this time thanks to the Luftwaffe success early in the war) becomes Fuhrer. At this point the Romulans reveal themselves directly to the Nazis (without telling them that they are the ones who killed Hitler) and begin providing covert technical aid, as well as strategic advice. One of the things they provide is a way to massively extend the range and quickly improve the armanent of Luftwaffe fighters (something that Goring would love), enabling the Luftwaffe to establish air superiority over Britain during the fall of 1940. In the spring of 1941, laser-armed and range-boosted ME-109s sweep the RAF from the skies, sink much of the Royal Navy, and force the British to capitulate.

The big problem I see here is what do you do with the Holocaust in the case of victorious Nazis? The idea of the Holocaust going even further in this reaity than it did in real life is very offensive.

Can the Romulans get the Nazis to tone down the racism and avoid genocide in time? Since they are Romulans, it seems unlikely they would oppose it on moral grounds. Perhaps they would oppose it on the grounds that it is inefficient and a waste of resources? "We'll help you conquer the world, but you have to stop this genocide nonsense?" Perhaps if you kill Hitler early enough the exterminationist program can be aborted?

Or perhaps the Romulans arrive about 1900 or so, adopt the British Empire as their clients, and we avoid WW1 and WW2 altogether.

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:21 pm: Edit

Michael: Yeah, you are right that the Italian and Spanish forms of facism were not particularly racist or anti-semitic, compared to Hitler anyway.

Perhaps the Romulans arrive in 1919 during the Versailles Peace Conference...it might not be a bad time from their point of view, the Terran powers are exhausted from war. Aliens show up, say "you think THAT was bad? Just wait to see what would happen to you if you don't go along with us."

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:26 pm: Edit

John:


If they arrived at the Paris Peace Conference with a ready-made vaccine for the Spanish influenza, that could be very useful as a carrot.

(Saving the lives of between fifty to a hundred million Terrans from that pandemic might be a great plus.)


Although, if you had the contact pre-WWI, you'd get to have both the Entente and Central powers take part in the off-world project.

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:28 pm: Edit

the more I think about it, the more I like the Versailles Idea.

The Romulans have been monitoring Earth for some time, waiting for the right moment for contact. They observe the fighting spirit of Terrans during the Great War, but wait until the war ends so that economic exhaustion has taken hold and everyone is sick of war.

The aliens land during the Versailles Conference, offer to provide technical assistance to assist the rebuilding of Europe and the world economies, in exhange for labor and access to Earth resources. It begins as something like a subject race type relationship, but over the years develops into more of a true partnership, as the Romulans discover how adaptable and dynamic humans can be.

World War II and III are avoided altogether. It still takes time for the Romu-Terran Empire to expand since they have to wait for the Old Kings to go away first.

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:30 pm: Edit

Gary: good point on the Spanish Influenza...

Of course, some conspiracy theorists might believe that the Romulans CAUSED the influenza just so that they could later show up publically and CURE it!

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:33 pm: Edit

As for Hitler, in 1923, a rebel-rousing former German soldier attempted to lead an anti-Romulan putsch in Munich, Bavaria, saying that the Romulans were evil invaders attempting to poison the blood of humanity.

The putsch was quickly put down, the former soldier arrested, tried, convicted, and shot for treason.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:36 pm: Edit

John:


I have to admit, the 'Paris 1919' idea is a really compelling one - not least since you could have the League of (Terran) Nations have a chance at becoming more than it was historically!


There'd have to be a few things worked out, though.

(Would the Vulcans back the Whites in the Russian Civil War? What about the central government in a fractured China? Or Ataturk's efforts to establish the Turkish Republic? What about the Irish war of independence? And so on.)


That said, a part of me like the idea of seeing heads of state like Wilhelm II and Nicholas II sitting around a conference table in the early 1910s, trying to argue out a common front to present to those alien envoys...


(As an aside, if anyone here hasn't read it yet, I highly recommend having a look for the book Paris 1919, from Margaret MacMillan. Well worth a look.)

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:43 pm: Edit

Hmmm...have to think about that one...neither side in the Russian Civil War are very attractive, the Whites are basically the same corrupt old guard that ruined the Russian Empire in the first place, while the Reds are bloodthirsty ideologues.

China totally lacks central leadership...it may actually be easier for the Roms to intervene there with a handpicked strongman of some kind.

I think they would likely support Ataturk. . .overall it would probably depend on which faction in which civil war is most "modern" by the Romulan point of view, ie;, the most secular and centralized.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 02:53 pm: Edit

Well, the Whites could at least include the likes of Kerensky, the head of the short-lived government founded after the February Revolution.

Maybe one condition for backing the Whites would be a restoration of Kerensky?

(This might be something that the Entente powers at Paris might insist on - since the Februarists were part of the alliance, while the Reds had dropped out of the war.)


In China, the complicating matter might be who could be picked that would placate Russian and Japanese interests, without placing someone who would be too unpopular to govern effectively.


In Turkey's case, Ataturk was less fighting a civil war than trying to affirm the sovereignty of the post-Ottoman successor state - but I'd say that as Kemal managed to successfully replace the Treaty of Sevres with that of Lausanne, he'd be able to do so in this case.

(Perhaps an increased effort to secure a White win in the Russian civil war meant that even with Vulcan help, the Great Powers simply pretty much had to let Ataturk's Turkey in from the cold.)


And as for Ireland? Well, maybe we'd be left as an 'internal matter' and get our Dominion-status Irish Free State, and UK-member Northern Ireland, as we did historically.

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 03:14 pm: Edit

Possibly....maybe Stalin dies as part of the Anti-Romulan underground. Anything that takes Hitler and Stalin out early is a good thing in my book.

Lenin was capable of turning on a dime tactically with long-term goals in mind, as with the Brest-Litvosk Treaty or with the New Economic Policy...it is possible he would move faster than the Whites in coming to an agreement with the Romulans. He might be able to position the Bolshevik movement as the "vanguard of mankind in cooperation with our Romulan brothers!"

Course if the Reds win, when Lenin dies do the Romulans back Stalin in his power struggle with Trotsky, Bukharin, etc.? Or perhaps advanced Romulan medicine spares Lenin's life, and he removes Stalin, as indeed he was preparing to do before being struck down by illness...

Lots of questions.

But I REALLY like the 1919 Romulan arrival.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 03:21 pm: Edit

Feel free to add Mao to that hit list, too!


The big thing that either side would have to deal with in the Russian case is how they are going to interact with the League.


The kind of isolation that the USSR took itself into during the 1920s, or the distance they kept from the Great Powers, will simply not fly in the face of a Vulcan-backed League.

(Not only would a government in opposition to the League member states be kept apart, but an intolerably large part of the planet would be kept out of the off-world project.)


The only way Lenin would get to rule in this case would be if he can somehow strike a balance between maintaining Russian/Soviet sovereignty while co-operating with the League and with the goals of the Vulcan empire.


Tough call.


(Although, if Lenin does prevail, perhaps this universe would get Trotsky rather than Stalin as the new leader after Lenin dies?)



Actually, here's another point.

If the 'League of Terran Nations' becomes the main conduit for human relations with the Vulcans and others, would the USA stay out, or would Congress vote to get in?

(Whichever way you slice it, they really couldn't afford not to get in on the ground floor.)

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 03:40 pm: Edit

Well part of the isolation of the Bolsheviks was because the western powers didn't want anything to do with them. At the same time, the wiser western leaders knew what the White Russian movement wasn't much better. Kerensky had no political base, which is why he was overthrown by the Reds in the first place. So I suppose it is up to Lenin...does he take a broader view and cooperate with the Rom/Terran League, or does he sink into his ideology and suspicion? It really could go either way with him. He was a murderous SOB but he did show tactical and strategic flexibility at times.

I agree that one way or another the Russians and Chinese HAVE to be involved. If no one internal can do it, the Romulans would have to impose someone, but without provoking a huge rebellion that they wouldn't be able to put down. I'm assuming that the Romulans don't want to just nuke the planet from orbit...they want and need human cooperation, grudging or not, to get their empire going.

I would argue that the US stays in...Romulan medicine cures Wilson of his medical problems (and perhaps Lenin too?) and the US joins the league. On the other hand, anti-alien opinion would still be there...perhaps right-wing movements such as the Ku Klux Klan or the National Socialists pop up as a reaction AGAINST aliens?

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 03:51 pm: Edit

Well, one of the catalysts for the rise of inter-war fascism was the Great Depression - something which need not happen for an Earth only beginning to shift to a new paradigm.


(Even before the Old Kings depart Zeta Reticuli, there are still relatively nearby places, like Mars, which could be colonised as a starting point.)


Perhaps the 'carrot' of such developments might be enough to sway whichever side deals with the League, and the Vulcans, first - and the subsequent introduction of things like new medical technologies could help lessen the reactionary opposition.


(Even as late as the 1920s, introducing the kind of health care taken as the norm in modern-day First World societies would be one seriously major step - let alone whatever the Vulcans deemed suitable to hand over.)



As an aside, I love the irony of how much this echoes what the historical Romulans might one day try to do regarding the Gerlunians - or what this alternate reality's Exiles (or ISC) could do with that same species.


(What would Kya-yai-following - and psionically active - Exiles make of the Satha'hi, for that matter?)

By John Sickels (Johnsickels) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 04:06 pm: Edit

Gary: well fascism gained momemtum due to the Great Depression, but it existed in nascent form as early as 1920 as a reaction to the post-Great War chaos. Yes, it didn't really become virulent until the GD hit and the wind was knocked out of the world economy, increasing misery and making people look for alternatives to democracy. But you are right, with Vulcan/Romulan tech, there is no need for the Depression to hit, at least not in the way it did. You would have economic disruption as new tech was integrated of course...but I don't see the Nazis rising in the way that they did in real life under these conditions.

I'm increasingly attracted to 1919 Alien arrival idea and wonder what SVC thinks of it.

(Yeah, I set up the Romulan/Gerlunian dynamic with this kind of thing in mind, giving people a chance to roleplay alien interference in a 20/21st century like society.)

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 04:11 pm: Edit

I hope that the Gerlunians at least (and maybe the Satha'hi, who might fare better with a Surak-inspired group of Vulcanoid psionics than the 'mundane' imperialists of regular-timeline Romulus) be co-opted in some manner by this timeline's exiles.

The Satha'hi might be restricted in the things they can do, but they could take part in medical and other non-military roles in tandem with Exile scientists and practitioners.

One could even imagine a war in which the 40-Eridani-A-Vulcans use Terran ground troops in a conflict against Exile-Vulcans using Gerlunian troops for the same purpose...

...unless the ISC get to them first.

(Ooh, Exile-ISC intrigue over the fate of Gerlunian 'self-determination'. I love it.)

By Jason E. Schaff (Jschaff297061) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 04:22 pm: Edit

How about if the "Romulans" were to arrive at Earth in the 1890-1905 timeframe? They might see a kindred spirit in the general policy of colonialism and expansionism being followed by most of the major powers during that era.

"We see that you have the proper spirit to join with us in seeking the glory of dominion over the universe! (and if you don't join us, you get to be slaves!)"

Hmm... Maybe the Romulans blew up the Maine from orbit as a demonstration of their power?

By Alan W. Kerr (Awkerr) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 04:42 pm: Edit

I really dislike the "Hitler or earlier" timeline changes. Changing a timeline so that "the Nazis win" is *so* overdone.

I would rather keep this in the future. My suggestion is that we use Space Seed and change the timeline there. SVC probably can't use Khan directly because of "Wrath of Khan". So... That's where history diverges. Khan loses. Khan is executed. The "Winner" does not want another "Khan" to ever happen again. So the Winner becomes increasingly imperialistic in the name of "Law and Order". Those that want, can have a "Nazi parallel" here with the Winner starting off with "new ideas" and heading towards "totalitarian control".

This way we don't *need* the aRomulans. Or they can show up and they "like the way we think". But either way, let's *not* do another "the Nazis win" timeline.

By Douglas Saldana (Dsal) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 05:07 pm: Edit

I'm not sure if this is on topic so I apologize if it is not:

I would like to see an alternate history in which the FX IKV Vandal (from "A Warrior's Death" in Captain's Log #12) succeeded in passing on X-tech and knowledge of future events to the Klingons of the early general war.

Specifically, I'm curious as to how the Klingons would have balanced their desire for a decisive victory in the General War with the knowledge that (even with the Vandal's secrets) they would need the cooperation of their enemies to defeat the Andromedans.

Perhaps the Klingons get greedy, totally defeat the Alliance, but then find they had altered the timeline too much for the Vandal's data on the Andromedans to be of much use to them. Facing defeat, they are then (in true t.v. show fashion) forced to find a way to alter events so that the original timeline is restored (by insuring the Vandal is destroyed before making contact).

The "Meta Timeline" would be something like this:

IKV Vandal goes back in time, DOES NOT encounter a Federation NCL (and therefore suffers no damage to its communications systems) and makes contact with the general war Klingons. With foreknowledge of Alliance battleplans and X-tech the Coalition suceeds in the total conquest of the Federation and Kzintis but at a much higher cost in blood and treasure than anticipated.

The Andromedans step up their invasion plans in response to events (unaware that they are not following the "script" in the Vandal's historical database) and the Klingons suddenly find that defeating the invasion is not the cakewalk they were expecting. Eventually (for whatever reason) the Klingons face defeat and, in desperation, send something back through time (using the same Supernova anomaly that originally sent the Vandal back) to lure a Federation Starship to the location of the Vandal's arrival hoping that it would destroy the Vandal.

History would then proceed as we know: the NCL fails to destroy the Vandal but, in damaging it's communications system, dooms it to eventual destruction at the hands of its fellow Klingons.

By Michael C. Grafton (Mike_Grafton) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 05:24 pm: Edit

Douglas,

If the Klinks had Xtech that early, the Andros would get stomped so badly it wouldn't be funny.

1) No secret RTN.
2) Plus the Klinks would roll over the opposition so fast it would make your head spin.

And of course, if the Klinks were building all X fleets, why not sell the Roms DOUBLE the numbers of KR ships. Imagine fighting a Rom fleet of K9R, KRC, 3 KR, KRS, 3 K6R and 3 K5R (battle group). And of course, all of them have drogues.

The question I'd have is would the Klinks just wipe out the Hydrans before turning on the Kzinti? Get into Vudar space early and stop the nacent revolution?

It would be interesting to see a Klingon Federated empire, with LDR, WYN, Tholian And vudar client states under firm control. Tholians have a half life of maybe a few weeks if the Klinks attack them with an ALL X harassment squadron.

By Robert Gamble (Rgamble) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 05:27 pm: Edit

Some very cool 'first contact' ideas here. That's not my major interest in the new timeline so I'm happy to see that others are enthused! My own interest in the project is how the Early Years through General War plays out so that's where I'll focus any of my ow additions to the discussion.

I'm going to post a 'compilation' of ideas from the previous couple of days for the Universe from 'Early Years' on, which may be helpful. I did it as a thought exercise last night, and I think it hangs together well, and should be able to connect to most of the back history being discussed here! Note that some of the discussion has moved beyond some of the questions I posed, or they've been more firmly settled. I am also working on a timeline which I could post in the next couple of days and will continue to modify based on apparent consensus on this thread.

By Robert Gamble (Rgamble) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 05:27 pm: Edit

Key Differences from the 'Prime Universe'

The Federation is replaced by a ‘Vulcan’/Human autocratic empire.

One possible explanation is that Surak dies before his movement can reach critical mass. His followers are the ones that have to leave Vulcan, and settle in the Southeast. They devote themselves to logic and understanding. Much more has been discussed above how this could all happen...

One previous question was what to call each group. At first the discussion used the term ‘Terran/Vulcan’ empire with the splinter Vulcans called the Romulans as in Universe Prime.

It was pointed out by Gary Carney that it would fit the SFU history better perhaps if the pointy eared guys who stayed home took the name of ‘Romulan’ and the ones who left took the name of ‘Vulcan’. The discussion recently seems to have settled on this concept, so for the purposes of the rest of this, I will use 'Romulans' for the ’stay homers’ and 'Vulcans' for the splinter group .

The Paravians survive via the explanation given in CL#28.

Mike West suggested the above. There are early years and General War era ships already created for the Paravians. The Paravians take over, more or less, the area controlled by the Gorns in the Prime Universe. They distrust everyone and are highly aggressive towards the Gorns/Vulcans (see below) and fight numerous wars with the Vulcan/Terran empire. Additionally, the Paravians might provide enough pressure on the Rom/Terran empire to keep the Rom/Terrans from crushing their neighbors.


The Gorns and Vulcans Unite

Also suggested by Mike West. The Vulcans permit the Gorns to settle in areas they’ve explored but not yet colonized. Eventually the two cultures form stronger ties to the extent of creating a unified government. The Vulcans gain Tactical Warp much earlier than in Universe Prime, and don’t need Klingon ships to modernize their fleet as they work with the Gorns. When the two cultures form a united government, they create modular ships: the concept is suggested by the Vulcans, but the ships have strong Gorn influences.

One concept proposed was that the modularity would be in the ‘rear saucers’.


The Carnivons Survive

Due to strong pressure from the Rom/Terran empire on the Kzintis and Klingons, earlier than occurred in Universe Prime, the Carnivons manage to survive until the General War era.

This provides some ‘crunch’ (new gameplay items in the form of GW era Carnivon ships (SSDs for Federation Commander and SFB).

And perhaps the Lyrans find the Carnivons tasty enough to replace the Hydrans as their delicacy of choice?


The Kzintis and Hydrans ‘trade places’

They don’t physically change places in the Alpha Octant, but they do swap their fates. The Kzintis are conquered by repeated assaults from the Lyrans, the Carnivons, the Klingons and the Rom/Terran empire. The Rom/Terran empire and the Carnivons are the main beneficiaries, splitting up the previous Kzinti territory.

The Kzinti could either go to the ‘off map’ regions of F&E, or as John Trauger suggested, they could flee en masse into the Wyn Cluster, only to return (perhaps during or after the General War when the Carnivons and Rom/Terran empire are fought out). They might win, they might not… I particularly like the thought that they return just in time to disrupt a major operation on Rom/Terran space.

Due to less pressure from the Klingons (who end up in a vicious protracted war with the Rom/Terran empire), the Hydrans primarily fight the Lyrans to numerous stalemates. The two empires gain a grudging respect for each other rather than the vicious hatred in Universe Prime, and thus could become allies (of necessity or even more in the vein of the Klingon/Lyran alliance in Universe Prime)


The Rom/Terran empire controls ‘Tholian Territory’ and are kicked out

Also suggested by Mike West. The Romn/Terran empire has conquered this part of Klingon space but leave it weakly defended while fighting other wars. The Tholians arrive and promptly destroy the outposts, and consolidate. The Rom/Terran empire loses contact with these outposts, and assume the Klingons attacked, only to later find out that there’s a new player in the area.


The ISC….

I’ll confess, I’m not a huge fan of the ISC. I think the above setup pretty much allows them to progress almost identically to Universe Prime, as they could observe Paravian/Gorn-Vulcan ships fighting instead of Gorn/Vulcan. Anyhow, I just haven’t given them much thought. ;)


The General War resembles Pre 1900 conflicts.

Instead of two sides which never change (at least once a member enters), this Octant level conflict has two foes which never stop fighting each other once they start (Rom/Terran vs Vulcan), but the other empires join and leave alliances, and strike each other when they sense a weakness. Eventually a stronger coalition against the Rom/Terran empire forms.

John Trauger suggested that even such rabid combatants as the Carnivons and Lyrans and Kzinti could be held together by the Klingons in a coalition, as long as they didn’t have to combine forces in battles. This has a nice precedent in the real world, as Germany’s minor allies (Romanians, Hungarians, etc) often refused to work together and even fought each other during WWII if placed in too close proximity. It also prevents the Rom/Terrans from being overwhelmed too quickly by effectively the entire West-Southeast fighting against them near the end due to problems with coordination and some of the empires refusing to come to the aid of the others, or even conducting their own opportunistic strikes against supposed allies. Personally I love the potential of this idea and it makes the General War of the Reflection Universe feel completely different from the Prime Universe.

By Gary Carney (Nerroth) on Friday, July 03, 2009 - 05:54 pm: Edit

Well, if you're not interested in dealing with the ISC, maybe I could try something.


*Keep the pre-Y40 history the same. After the Resource World conflicts, the Five Races develop tactical warp, divvy up the Resource Worlds by treaty, and start expanding into the wider Octant.

*Perhaps have the kind of resource exploitation which led to the historical Space Boar stampedes be less of an issue - which would slow down the onset of the proto-ISC organisation.

This would mean the Five Races would expand separately for longer, rather than co-ordinate via the proto-ISC.


*Maybe have the Paravians launch long-range raids into the furthest reaches of the nearest Five Race colonies. The Five Races try to co-operate against the raiders (in battles which would give W-era Paravians a chance to fight the W-ships from Y2) and work on their technological research.


*The first Y-era Paravian raiders provoke a series of upgrades - but it becomes more evident that the Five Races have to replace their older ships with newer ones to keep up. So, they jointly develop the Y-era fleet, and each home world builds the same hull design under licence.


*In the Y-era, the Five Races, expanding faster than in the regular timeline, encounter other non-Paravian empires (whoever they turn out to be). This discovery only adds to the logistical imperative pushing the five into a more integral military infrastructure, and a political organisation to match.

Thus, the ISC, and the unified Navy, are born.


*When the Middle Years rolls in, the ISC develop their TL12 ships (pre-refit CAs, CLs etc) from Y127 onwards, and roll in other technologies in keeping with the guidelines in Y2.

In this era, the Navy tries to keep pace with Paravian technological advances, fends off increasing Orion infestations, and interacts to a greater or lesser degree with the others nearby.

One could, perhaps, have the level of Paravian aggression to the 'west' and 'south' moderated one way or another by the amount of pressure being soaked up by the ISC.

(And when it comes to the Exiles - Gorn-allied or not - perhaps one point of contention might be the right to 'self-determination' for species in space yet to be formally claimed by either side, such as Gerlunia. The two powers might not necessarily be overtly mutually antagonistic, but not exactly all that chummy either.)



*Now this is the big one, as I see it - instead of the Pacification (which this ISC wouldn't care about) the Concordium has to fight off a Souldra infestation from the Void, while trying to keep opportunistic Paravians and others at bay. While the Paravians and others might have their own territories close to the Void, it would be the ISC which would bear the brunt - and if one wishes to keep them out of the General War anyway, it's as good a war as any to fight.

This war may or may not involve long-range Loriyill Splinter Collective task forces - but would not by any means be intended as a free-for-all regarding throwing in other Omega powers.

(I could potentially see the odd Bolosco or Iridani ship fly over the Energy Barrier to make contact - but that's it.)


*By the time the Souldra would be beaten back, the ISC could take part in the Andromedan War, or perhaps find itself caught by the Andros just as they were trying to finish the Souldra off.

(Well, only the Loriyill can finish the Souldra off directly, by assaulting the Black Sun logistics hub in the Void - but maybe they can act as guides for ISC X-ships trying to get there and back? That would still mean the ISC can't cross all the way to Omega directly, since the Loriyill would refuse to take them there.)

Eventually, the ISC would be able to help take down the RTN, and maybe join this universe's equivalent of Operation Unity.


This would give each era of ISC ships some distinct enemies to fight, from the Paravians and Exiles to the Orions and Souldra. It would also give them different types of ships to fight those varied foes with, from the diverse Five Race ships to the unified Y-era hulls, and from the vessels of a longer Middle Years time period to the advent of X-technology starships.