Whatever is causing the Boeing pods so much trouble, I just hope they don't have doors blowing out mid-flight on them...

By John Wyszynski (Starsabre) on Thursday, August 08, 2024 - 06:17 am: Edit

The SpaceX Crew 9 launch has been delayed as part of the contingency planning. If needed they will bump two of the crew and go up with just two. Butch and Suni would become part of that crew. Would not return until February. At least they will get their toiletries which got bumped from Starliner for toilet parts.

Kinda sucks for the two not going up.

(Queue up the Gillian's Island music.)

By Mike Dowd (Mike_Dowd) on Thursday, August 08, 2024 - 06:34 am: Edit

"If one door closes, and another one opens, you're probably flying Boeing."

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Thursday, August 08, 2024 - 10:57 am: Edit

It's be what 63 years since Liberty Ball 7 cracked due to a malfunction, and here we are making the same jokes about it happening again to Starliner.

Unfortunately I feel it really is best to bring the crew back on a Dragon Capsule. Then try to self reenter Constellation. If it is success NASA may look a little foolish but they errored on the side of caution. If it fails terminate the contract with Boeing, and open a fraud investigation into Boeing.

By Jessica Orsini (Jessica_Orsini) on Thursday, August 08, 2024 - 11:52 am: Edit

An uncrewed return of the Starliner capsule is not an option; its computer software is not equipped for uncrewed flight.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Thursday, August 08, 2024 - 12:01 pm: Edit

They can reprogram starliner for non-crew, but NASA said doing that in orbit would take weeks. The thruster problem might not be fixable in orbit. I heard on the news that abandoning star liner in a parking orbit is a serious option.

By Paul Howard (Raven) on Friday, August 09, 2024 - 04:32 am: Edit

On holiday so not caught any news (other than the Olympics) about the issues.


Easy question to ask - is it that bad for Starliner?

Dal's comments seems to be 'it might be OK'.... but SVC's comments seems to be fairly terminal (IMHO).

By Jessica Orsini (Jessica_Orsini) on Friday, August 09, 2024 - 08:43 am: Edit

It's extremely bad for Starliner.

By Paul Howard (Raven) on Friday, August 09, 2024 - 11:43 am: Edit

Well, just read up abit on it.

I think Jessica has perhaps summed it up best.

Well, I return home in just under two weeks time.... so probably don't have time to type about each issue so far reported.

OK, it's primairly just two issues - the Thrusters (which could Kill everyone in Capsule AND the ISS station - or just kill everyone on reentry, if something goes wrong - and clearly they did in the travel to the station) or the lack of remote launching and landing software...which blocks one of the two port concerns (NASA doesn't want to 'Brick' one.... sums it up nicely) - but there clearly are other issues too.

So extremely bad seems to be a clean and precise answer.

No wonder Elon Musk is wanting the next Space X launch to be delayed and used as a rescue mission....

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Friday, August 09, 2024 - 04:54 pm: Edit

>> Musk is wanting the next Space X launch to be delayed and used as a rescue mission

A wise precaution. Given the overall circumstances, wouldn't it be a good idea to always have the production pipeline be 1 rocket deeper than needed, so an emergency can be quickly responded to?

--Mike

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Wednesday, August 14, 2024 - 05:50 am: Edit

SpaceEx plans to launch four astronauts into (for the first time) polar orbit.

By John Wyszynski (Starsabre) on Tuesday, August 20, 2024 - 10:03 pm: Edit

NASA needs to make decision on Starliner by next week. They need to clear that docking port. They can't launch Crew Dragon until then. And then there's a Cargo Dragon scheduled after the Crew Dragon swap. It is backing up the schedule.

The Polaris Dawn I mission is to launch on Monday around 3 am. The is a commercial flight that will be the highest orbital flight (moon flight not included). Also first commercial space walks. About 8 days.

Another commercial flight is planned, the Fram 2. This is a near polar flight; radiation over poles restricts how close. This will have a non-Amercan crew. Like 3-5 days.

Sierra Dream Chaser (cargo version) has been bumped from Vulcan rocket. Probably going on a Falcon Heavy if ready by year's end.

By Dal Downing (Rambler) on Wednesday, August 21, 2024 - 01:01 am: Edit

NASA has set a hard undock date for Stuckliner. September 6th with or without a crew.

By Nick Blank (Nickgb) on Saturday, August 24, 2024 - 01:57 pm: Edit

Looks like NASA decided not to trust Boeing Starliner with a crew again.

Starliner crew will remain on board the ISS until February and return on a future Space-X Dragon capsule that will launch with 2 empty seats.

In the meantime Starliner will return unmanned.

By John Wyszynski (Starsabre) on Saturday, August 24, 2024 - 02:24 pm: Edit

Boeing is in serious trouble. The Starliner is the most visible space project. But earlier in August, the NASA IG released a scathing report on Boeing's SLS work. Poor quality control and poorly trained workers.

They aren't the only one. Collins Aerospace is supposed to be developing a new EVA suit. They have used up the money and want out of the contract. Again it looks like SpaceX will have to come to the rescue; they are going to test/use their own version next week.

By Tom Lusco (Tlusco) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 09:26 am: Edit

It really is oldSpace vs. newSpace: DoD-oriented cost-plus contracts that drag on and on becuase the only historic penalty for failure was the need to convince the right politicians. Which was just money, which would be returned in spades with a contract extension. Vs. NewSpace that is business-focused and not afraid to fail. Sometimes they fail badly (there have been many failed rocket companies) but then there's SpaceX and RocketLab.

The bad part is that with commercial contracting the way to go, we need at least two viable competitors. Right now its looking increasingly like its SpaceX or bust.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 01:53 pm: Edit

The Artemis Orion heat shield does not work. During heating of the unmanned test showed that the shield flakes in pieces big enough to destroy the parachutes. The whole timeline is now trashed.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 07:17 pm: Edit

Someone tell me the difference between Starliner and Orion capsules?

By Michael F Guntly (Ares) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 09:03 pm: Edit

From what I can find, Orion is designed to go to the moon and beyond, Starliner is a low-earth orbit capsule, designed to get astronauts and cargo up to the International Space Station, and back again. The capsules are equipped differently to perform their specific roles.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 09:28 pm: Edit

thank you

By Will McCammon (Djdood) on Monday, August 26, 2024 - 10:02 pm: Edit

Different builders too. Orion is Lockheed Martin. Starliner is Boeing.

The heat shield for Orion is much more of a design challenge, as the speeds involved in a return from lunar trips are much, much higher than low-Earth orbit. Apollo had the same challenges, building from what Mercury and Gemini learned in LEO.

Orion is also bigger, but that doesn't add to the heat shield challenges nearly as much as the speeds.

By Nick Blank (Nickgb) on Tuesday, August 27, 2024 - 10:03 am: Edit

Orion is designed to go outside the Earth's radiation belts. You can point the service module in the direction of incoming radiation/solar flare and use the fuel and mass of the service module as radiation shielding. There are other radiation design considerations that Starliner has not had to take into account since it will always be inside Earth's radiation belts.

Orion has 20 or so days of endurance for a 4 man crew as opposed to just a couple of days for Starliner to make it to the ISS.

Orion has toilet facilites, Starliner has the diapers/pee in a bag system.

Starliner is meant to be reusable, Orion is one mission, then stick it in a museum.

Starliner lands on the ground with airbags, Orion splashes down in the ocean like Apollo and Space-X Dragon.

By Steve Cole (Stevecole) on Tuesday, August 27, 2024 - 11:10 am: Edit

Thanks, Nick

By Mike Erickson (Mike_Erickson) on Tuesday, August 27, 2024 - 01:24 pm: Edit

Excellent, concise articulation of the differences!

By Garth L. Getgen (Sgt_G) on Tuesday, September 03, 2024 - 11:23 pm: Edit

A co-worker suggested that when the stranded astronauts finally get to come back to Earth in February, the entire NASA crew should come out to greet them ... all wearing gorilla suits.


Garth L. Getgen